It was last week that we saw the Mets opened up their mini camp where several players were on hand to test themselves out earlier then usual to see how they were going along physically. One player who everyone was there to see was Johan Santana who was schedule to make some tosses to test out his repaired left arm. Santana made 25 pitches, said everything felt fine, and that he was excited to see what this season brings. He was fine for now, able to throw his bread and butter pitch(the change up) with ease just like the Santana of old. One player who was not at the mini camp, but who we saw last night on the Mets SNY station is Jose Reyes, who was in Long Island flexing his muscles & working himself back into playing shape while doing sprints & a variety of stretch exercises. It looked like Jose was ready to play baseball tomorrow. He showed his beaming Jose Reyes's smile that told you he was back & went on to say that he could not wait to hit a triple. Showing the scar left from the surgery he had last year to repair his torn hammy, Reyes said he could not wait to get going while telling the fans to be there in 2010 because it's going to be a show. I'm already counting the days.
This is where the NY Mets are today, a team full of high profile players who are trying to make it all the way back from a injury plague 2009 season. The Mets are trying to restore the faith to a fan base that has lost faith in them by showing them glimpses of their players in action looking like their ready to go.
But who is to say that Jose Reyes leg woes won't fail him again? Or that Santana's arm won't blow up? Every where you look on this Met roster you have to pray and hope that we can maintain enough players healthy to stay on the field in hopes to be in it to at least contend. From John Maine to K-ROD, a big part of being a Met fan today is having it in the back of your mind that at any time one of your hero's may go down for good, just look at Carlos Beltran who is already on schedule to begin the season on the DL.
Last week we caught a glimpse of our ACE Santana and his comings along, what we saw was that for the moment he is ok & on schedule, but keep your fingers crossed because these are the Mets were talking about.
36 comments:
Great line by Joel Sherman in his twitter:
"How long before we find out that Toyota is the official car of the New York Mets?"
I remember back in the days,
back in the 80's, the Yankees use to bring in their relief pitchers from the bullpen in a toyoya, remember that pinstripe Toyoya?heehee
Mets just can't get anything right.
Yeah, I remember those days. They would give the car away at the end of each disappointing season.
Ah, the bullpen car. Classic
Yea it was a piece a shit Toyota but all I remember was that it was the coolest car just because it had the cool pinstripes.
So Manuel is talking about having Reyes bat 3rd. Thoughts?
Good & Bad,
I think it may be a bad idea because last season these same references were made by Manuel and it supposedly rubbed Reyes the wrong way, this time around Reyes has said to be ok with the idea, so if it happens, we shall see.
I think it could be a good if Reyes is able to get back to being Jose Reyes. As a fan of Reyes, I look for that evolution of his game that Jerry Manuel talks about, that by batting him 3rd kind of makes it possible. You also get to ease him back into the lineup after the leg injury riddled season of 2009. Hopefully he won’t lose his aggressiveness from being the leadoff hitter and stealing bases.
The Met lineup without Beltran loses a lot & I think that by batting Reyes 3rd it helps mask Beltran’s absence, if it fails then you plug Reyes back in the leadoff spot once Beltran comes back, in other words what do you got to lose?
What do u have to lose? How about a whole fan base? I told Ray and I'll tell you. This is an awful move if it happens. Manuel is not a good manager as this thought process shows. Baseball is a traditional tried and true sport that has certain formulas that work and should never change. Let me try to explain how dumb Manuel is.
I don't have the YES network because I am obviously out of market. However, I do get the channel when the Yankees are playing because I subscribe to the MLB package with Directv. So when there's a rain delay of any length, the YES network starts showing other programming until the game starts up again. One of these times a few years ago, Joe Torre was doing one of those kids shows. I think it's called Yankees on deck or something. I'm not sure. But if you ever watched it you'd know what I'm talking about. It is OBVIOUSLY made and produced for children and you can tell by the way they talk and use graphics that it's for kids.
So they had kids asking Torre various questions. One intelligent kid asked and I'm paraphrasing, 'How do you know where in the lineup to put your players' or 'What determines where you put your players in the lineup." Something to that effect. So Torre explained that by trial and error lineups are designed the same for a reason. He explained that the leadoff guy is usually the fastest guy on the team as long as he has a decent OBP or can hit for average. And he went on and on and explained every slot in the order. The thing I want to bring home here is that he stressed that your fast guys and the guys who could take a walk are in the top of your lineup and are there because you want your power guys 3-4-5-6 to drive them home.
What in Manuel's mind would make him think Reyes is that sort of player? In the only four FULL seasons Reyes has had, he has batted .300 once and it was exactly .300. Also in that span, the highest OBP he's had is .358. Which isn't great for a player of his talent. It should be reaching the high .380's and bordering .400's. How could he be depended on to drive in runs when he can't even get on base with the most elite In the game? This may all sound like a knock on him but it's not. It's a knock on Manuel for not realizing he's a leadoff hitter. Reyes is a dynamic player with great talent but it has yet to even be harnassed. And he does not have power, especially in city field. In fact, the new stadium is built for him to get a shitload of doubled and triples. He can run all day long.
Oh, and Reyes isn't really Ok with it. You have to keep in mind that players who are out for a whole or a majority of a season will typically go along with anything just to feel like they are contributing or to appease management, the manager and the fans. I wouldn't feel comfortable being asked to be a RBI producer when all my life I was a run producer.
And like Ray mentioned to me last week. Why does Manuel get a pass being as baseball dumb as he is?
Oh, last thing. I'm sure you understood my point but the reason I even brought up Torre and the kids was to demonstrate that even a kid could understand why Reyes is and should be a leadoff hitter. Manuel a full fledged adult and "baseball" man doesn't get it. I don't hear Minaya knocking on his door which makes him just as guilty. When the Yankees were considering going the entire playoffs with the three man rotation, Girardi and Cashman talked it over and hashed it out.
I think you’re giving it way too much thought here, it is just an experiment and I as a fan will be interested to see if Reyes can deliver at the 3rd slot. Like I said, if it doesn’t work out then you go back to Reyes in the leadoff spot, & if he is able to deliver then he is evolving into the player we think he is capable of.
The whole Torre with the Kids part you used to break this down with is really just kids stuff, I really didn’t see anything that can be useful from that in breaking down this topic other then you claiming that Jerry Manuel is as dumb as a 5th grader.
Yea you want power guys at your power spots, but sometime the 3rd place hitter is not always a wall banger type, plus like you said, the Mets play in Citifield and this is not the AL which is what pretty much Torre was talking about with those kids.
You go on to say that Reyes is a dynamic player with great talent, which is why I don’t mind seeing Reyes at the 3rd slot while Beltran is out. Then you say that he does not have any power, but you forget that in one of those 4 full seasons, Reyes once hit 19 HR’s and drove in 80 runs from the leadoff spot., imagine how many more runs he can drive in at the 3rd slot?
If anything I question Reyes mental toughness in these run producing situations because I do not see him as a clutch hitter. Still maybe giving him this chance to shine on a different level may do him some good, who knows, if not, then again it is just an experiment.
He is no power hitter by any stretch, but in Citified who cares; this is a ballpark that is built for pitching and speed, which is another reason why it might work with a guy like Reyes who is a dynamic player who is still very capable of hitting 15 to 20 bombs. The Cardinals of the 80’s had guys like Willie McGee & Tommy Herr batting 3rd and they did just fine with those guys, & I like to see the Mets play a little of that brand of baseball in that ballpark. Plus it is not like the Mets do not have anyone else who they can plug in at the leadoff spot because Luis Castillo has done that for most of his career and will fill right in nicely.
Were not looking for Reyes to change his game and become a HR hitter, what Manuel is hoping for is for Reyes to hit a couple of gapers with some men on base and the occasional HR, He is looking for one of his core guy to step up his game to another level while Beltran is out and that chosen player is Reyes who we hope is 100% healthy to do it.
Do I see this as Manuel being dumb as a 5th grader like you do? All I see here is a manager who knows that his ass is on the line here, and who is going to go out by doing it his way. Nothing wrong with that, in fact I kind of like it.
Like I said, if it doesn’t work out then you go back to Reyes at the leadoff spot.
Your argument is flawed. Derek Jeter and Johnny Damon are the reason why. You put this out: "Reyes once hit 19 HR’s and drove in 80 runs from the leadoff spot., imagine how many more runs he can drive in at the 3rd slot?"
First, this isn't Shea. You won't see 19 HR's again.
Yes, let's imagine what Jeter or Damon would have done if they batted third their whole career. PLEASE. Both Jeter and Damon have had better numbers than that and u don't see them batting third. Are u kidding me Freddy? U can't want the Mets to win so bad that you are that naive. I want you to look up the last time someone whole stole over 70 bases and batted third. It's not going to happen. Why? Because you can't steal when someone slower is in front of you in the base path. When I said he was a dynamic player. I was talking SOLELY about his speed. Speed is a game changer and Manuel is going to hurt that. Your talking about putting him in the third spot and taking away his only weapon. The guys bat is nothing to write home about. On top of that, he is far from clutch.
"if he is able to deliver then he is evolving into the player we think he is capable of."
SAY WHAT? Who's we? You think he is capable of being a three hitter? Please share some of that ganja with me. I'm moving to California in June and will have medicinal marijuana clinics near by but if you have good shit then by all means please share.
"The whole Torre with the Kids part you used to break this down with is really just kids stuff, I really didn’t see anything that can be useful from that in breaking down this topic other then you claiming that Jerry Manuel is as dumb as a 5th grader."
YOU SAID IT. I DIDNT. You didn't see the point? The point is that a kid can make the lineup and they would know to put Reyes first.
You say it's an experiment and if doesn't work, then back he goes. That easy huh? Why would it fail? Because he wouldn't be producing runs. You think that his ego will be just fine when he's gotta move from the third spot because he couldn't do the job?
He's going to start thinking he shouldn't have been there in the first place and that will play just great when he starts considering that the Mets don't know how to use him during a contract year.
Gotta go with Danny P. on this one. Why would you move Reyes to the #3 spot? It does not make sense. You have a guy that if he walks or gets a single can move to 2nd and possibly 3rd before you have out and you want to move him down in the lineup? Very few things for the Mets are set in stone: Johan is your #1 pitcher, KRod is your closer and 3rd one should be that Reyes is your lead off hitter. I'm sure that smarter heads will prevail and they'll leave Reyes where he belongs, batting 1st.
(First, this isn't Shea. You won't see 19 HR's again.)
Is it really that far fetch to think that Jose Reyes won't get close to 20 hr's again? He did it once in a big ballpark called Shea, when he was just a pup.
Right now he is still only 26 year old & you make it sound like there is no room for improvement in his game.
Is he clutch? I already had said no. As far as clutch goes, Derek Jeter or Johnny Damon he is not. And was I saying that Reyes is a better 3rd spot hitter then Derek Jeter? No, so stop creating a false argument. All I was saying was that I as a fan, wanted to see (my boy) Jose Reyes given the shot to see what he can do from the 3rd slot. Does it mean that Jerry Manuel will leave him there when Beltran comes back? No. This is just an experiment that Manuel may try out for the moment to see if it gives Reyes the chance to evolve as a player, that is all I see from this, and I as a fan of Jose, would simply like to see what he can do in that situation. Does it make me naive for wanting to see what Reyes can do in the 3 spot? I am just a fan.
If he fails, & you see that it may be getting in his head, then you put him back in his old leadoff slot. Like I said, I think it can be a good idea for the moment because Reyes is coming back from a leg injury and I think slowing his running game a bit may be a good thing for now. No one is saying that Jose Reyes will be the Mets 3rd place hitter in the future, not right now, maybe when he is in his 30's and he puts on that wt, if he is still here, then maybe. Right now he is the Mets leadoff hitter, & one of the best in the game, and right now the manager is just talking about trying something new, or maybe he is just talking.
All I am looking for in this experiment is if Jose Reyes can become a better clutch hitter.
Again, if he can evolve as a player, take it to another level.
Like I said I think you are over thinking something that we all know is just an experiment, one that the manager is willing to take to try and save his job even if it backfires on him.
When I said imagine what Reyes can do if he hits in the 3rd slot when putting up the 19hr's while driving in the 80 rbi's, all I was trying to prove was that he can drive in runs.
Just enjoy the game.
RAY I'm pretty sure that once Beltran comes back that Manuel will put Reyes back where he belongs. Again this is just a chance to slow his running game while trying to mask the absent of Beltran, while trying to make him a better clutch hitter.
Are u one of those people that reads but doesn't understand what you just read when you are done? I think it went in one ear and out the other.
"And was I saying that Reyes is a better 3rd spot hitter then Derek Jeter? No, so stop creating a false argument."
READ CLOSELY: YOU ARE MAKING MY POINT! DEREK JETER HAS NEVER BEEN IN THE THREE HOLE. HE IS PLACED WHERE HE IS MOST VALUABLE.
Reyes WILL never be qualified to be in the three hole. Not now and not in the future. What makes you so sure they keep him next year with the 2010 free agent class?
Oh, and Manuel is a dumbass who happen to be at the right place when Willie was blamed fir the Franchise's ineptitude.
I'm willing to put my money where my typing is. I will bet you $50 that Reyes doesn't hit 15 HR's (for this wager inside the park DOES NOT count). You are so sure so don't back down now.
Slow his running game? WTF r u talking about man? Why would u ever want to slow this guy down? And what's this one of the best ever campaign for Reyes? That boy needs some serious yrs of consistency to be put in that category. His running game is elite his bat is not.
Lastly, what is this about his evolution as a player? How about he evolve as a leadoff hitter before asking him to "experiment" as an RBI producer.
I seriously hope you think about your next post. When I first read about this, I thought it was crazy. Everything I've seen on MLBN and ESPN have confirmed that this isn't a good idea.
If you want to experiment during spring training then yeah, by all means but I wouldn't even think about doing something like that in the regular season. The only way I would even entertain the thought is if the Mets were to land an even better lead off hitter but that doesn't look like it'll be happening. Why mess with a good thing? I guess you can't be surprised by thoughts like this from the Mets, I'm just glad the Yankees aren't run that way. Keep that shit in Queens.
$50 on Reyes to hit more than 15? Thats enticing.
Whatever man, you think it such a bad idea and I think it's not such a big deal.
What Reyes won't hit 15 homeruns again? whatever.
What Derek Jeter has never hit in the 3rd slot once or twice?
Why would you want to ever slow his game? because like I said 3 times already he is coming off a leg injury!
Your such a big expert you should be on ESPN with the rest of the big deal makers.
Exactly Ray, this is a experiment that most likely will only take place during spring training games, Danny is making it sound like Jerry Manuel intends to do this all year long. Like I said this could be a good thing or it can be a bad thing, good if Reyes is able to be more of a clutch hitter, and bad if he just fails and it messes with his head a little, but not such a big deal as you guys are making it out to be.
"What Reyes won't hit 15 homeruns again? whatever."
Whatever? Dude, this is the easiest bet of your life. You said whatever right? No big deal? I didnt read that u accepted the wager. Be a man and grow a set. I ain't afraid to lose. Make the season more interesting... for the Mets.
Alright u r a dumbass for the rest of your reply.
Anyway, Ray, you can get in on that. I'm even thinking of giving 2 to 1 odds. Talk about enticing. You won't get these odds in Vegas.
( I guess you can't be surprised by thoughts like this from the Mets, I'm just glad the Yankees aren't run that way. Keep that shit in Queens.)
Yea Ray like the Yankees never makes dumb moves, it's been like 2 years now and the Yankees still can't figure out that Joba is better off as the 8th inning man with the possibility of being the future closer. Do you still like that experiment? it's like night and day.
1st of all I don't bet, and 2nd the guy is coming off an injury season, you think he wont get hurt again? please go make that bet with Ray, I'm saying Reyes will hit 20 HR's a couple of times before his career is over, I didn't say he was going to do it this year.
Oh and what is this shit about slowing him down because he's coming off a leg injury? This is the same guy they are going to march out there on opening day at 100% You think he won't be stealing bases in spring training? Whatvis wrong with the way u think. You think he's going to play with fear? Slow him down? Dude just listen to yourself. Why would you have your fastest guy on ur team, who causes havoc on the bases, play if he isnt or can't do what he does best. You act like he just healed this leg injury last week. This dude has been sitting on his ass for nine months. Trust me. He's ready to go. Slow him down. You are hilarious.
FREDDY YOU ARE A DUMBASS. HOW MANY TIMES MUST IT RING TRUE.
Your Joba example is such a horrendous example. Joba has not had one full season with unrestricted innings. The way the Yanks handled that leaves something to be desired. But Joba hasn't even been given a fair chance. It's dumb of you to day the experiment has even been tested. If he wins the job this year, come talk to me.
Freddy you are the biggest cop out ever. You state "whatever" when you are so sure Reyes will hit 20 and now ur pussying out that you didn't say it was this yr? What a pussy move. I gotta call twat on that. What's this 20 talk? I said 15.
(Oh and what is this shit about slowing him down because he's coming off a leg injury?)
yea just throw him out there and let him run into another leg injury, nothing wrong with having a little caution, because if this was the Yankees taking their time with one of their players this would be ok but because this is the bumbling Mets, no way.
yea just throw him out there and let him run into another leg injury, nothing wrong with having a little caution,
RAY, you reading this?? Let's play preventive baseball. Freddy, I hope u never run into a shitload of money. I'd be scared you'd buy a team.
The only thing the Champions are careful with is pitching.
(The only thing the Champions are careful with is pitching)
Yea the Yankees werent careful with A-ROD last year when he came back from hip surgery, even when the guy looked INCREDIBLE after coming back it was you guys giving the Yankees praises for giving A-ROD a day off once in a while & being caution with him.
talk about double standards, the Yankees never do anything wrong and the Mets are the Mets.
I didn't even understand the point of your last post.
"even when the guy looked INCREDIBLE after coming back"
Wrong you are my man. Arod hit a HR on his first swing back from the DL. After that he went into a DEEP slump. Dont talk about shit you don't know about. Because of pride he did not want to take a day off. Once Girardi and Cashman decided to force him to take a day off per week is when he got hot. If you're going to make a point, please know what your talking about. I don't expect u to know the ins and outs of the Yankees because I expect you to be watching every Mets game. Double standard? No. Get your shit together. If you don't know what your talking about, how can we have a point/counterpoint?
The Yankees aren't perfect butvthey are Champions so I guess you can't closer than that. The Mets are ... well you know.
"Exactly Ray, this is a experiment that most likely will only take place during spring training games, Danny is making it sound like Jerry Manuel intends to do this all year long"
February 25, 2010, 9:00 PM
Mets Lineup Takes Shape
PORT ST. LUCIE, Fla. — Each day Jerry Manuel gives more indications of how he would like his batting order to shape up. Thursday he said he wants Daniel Murphy to bat sixth, which means Jeff Francoeur would bat seventh, and the catcher eighth. Using Murphy there helps split up the right-handed bats.
So, it could look something like this on opening day:
Angel Pagan
Luis Castillo
Jose Reyes
Jason Bay
David Wright
Daniel Murphy
Jeff Francoeur
Rod Barajas
Johan Santana
I'm just saying.
Yes the lineup could look something like that, except instead of batting Angel Pagan in the lead off slot, it should be Castillo who is a better OBP player & who has experience at the lead off slot.
This is an experiment, and if you’re going to do this, doing it during spring training games is the way go. This is not about making Reyes the official 3rd slot hitter, this is about buying time until Beltran comes back, and being cautious with Reyes at the same time.
Like I said, you may not like the idea and may fine it ridiculous, but I like to see what (my boy Reyes), can do in that situation, hopefully he can gain some confidence & become more of a clutch hitter. By batting him 3rd behind Bay and Wright it means he will see more fastballs which may lead to him delivering at time, which should give him that confident to be more of a clutch hitter when he is back in his natural slot of leadoff, but I’m sure you’ll have something to chime in about.
I'm just saying.
You want to see your boy be more clutch but I'd like to see him walk away from a disaster of a franchise.
When Omar Minaya is fired, I'll gain some level of respect. He gives Dominicans a terrible name. Because of him the baseball world thinks we should stick to the field. Thanks Omar.
The Mets have come under fire from fans and sports commentators this winter for not acting boldly enough to improve the team. Aside from Jason Bay, General Manager Omar Minaya has signed primarily castoffs and reclamation projects.
Inaction, or the perception of inaction, is not new in Flushing. In the 1970s, the Mets were almost pathological in their disdain for signing free agents. Back then, as the Yankees signed star players with both hands, the Mets nurtured budding stars like Steve Henderson, Lee Mazzilli and John Stearns.
The Mets even chose a mascot that mimicked their stubbornness: Mettle the mule. In 1979, the few fans who visited Shea saw the mule stride up and down the foul lines before games.
There are few pictures of Mettle on the Internet. But one surfaced recently in a shoebox at my brother’s house.
Mettle was the brainchild of Bebe DeRoulet, the daughter of Lorinda DeRoulet, who inherited the team from her mother, Joan Payson, the first owner of the Mets. The name was chosen in a contest won by a fan, Dolores Mapps, from Mercerville, N.J. Mapps said she chose Mettle because it typified the team’s “spirit, ardor, stamina and courage, all of which the Mets have in abundance.”
It arrived three years after the A’s put Charlie-O the mule out to pasture in Oakland. That mule was named after Charles O. Finley, the team’s owner. The mule was a gift to the team when it was Kansas City. The mule, you see, is the state animal of Missouri.
(Curiously, the mule had replaced an elephant as the A’s mascot.)
Mettle did little for the Mets in 1979. The team finished in last place and averaged fewer than 10,000 fans a game, an all-time low for the Mets. The team was sold the next year to a group led by Nelson Doubleday and Fred Wilpon. The new owners wisely chose to send Mettle packing and spend their money on other things.
Like Omar Minaya (I added this part)
Nice little mule story that I didn't know was part of bad Mets history, but this post has turned into many things. It went from restoring the Faith, to Jose Reyes batting 3rd, to now Omar Minaya gives Dominicans a bad name. It's all good, it's your opinion and Omar has done plenty to get the bad press. But the media has not been easy, I know they have a job to do and they do it well.
But what do you want Omar to do? Is it all his fault? you know how it goes.
Danny can you at least say that the guy recognizes talent? is it his fault that the Mets doctors don't know from a hole in the ground? Like the article you posted said, the Mets of the 70's were a joke of a franchise, but you can no longer associate the Mets with those same god awful teams from the 70's. If anything Omar came in and gave the Mets relevance. He has helped put the Mets back on the back pages right there with the NY Yankees, who up until last season when they won it all, had their share of bad press with the media doing what they do best to NY teams, sell those papers.
Has it worked out for Omar & the Mets? obviously not, but as far as bringing in bigtime players to the NY Mets ballclub, Omar has done better then any other GM in NY Mets history. He has spent the money trying to make the Mets better that they now rival those mighty NY Yankees as far as expectation goes every year. Not even Frank Cashen did more wheeling and dealing then Omar Minaya.
With the exception of this past offseason, Omar has done the job IMO, in trying to improve the Mets every year. I do not 2nd guess any of the big name players he has signed on to be a Met, do you?
Sure Omar Minaya is no Rakim on the mic, his word play in front of the press makes me cringe, Yes Adam Rubin was a mess, Tony Bernazard was a mess, and the firing of Willie was a mess, I can clearly see where you have a beef here.
The pressure from all the media stuff has gotten to Omar and it shows. No more does he has full authority, that was clear this past offseason and I think some of it has to do with some lost money problems the Mets suffered to the hands of the Madoff character. But most of it has to do with the many media mistakes Omar has made which has led to him being a puppet today.
Omar has pretty much run his coarse here, his time with the Mets now hinges on the Mets getting off to a good start and pretty much winning it all in 2010. The media has pretty much written his eulogy. A bad start to the 2010 season & Omar is gone. Like I said, the pressure will be on Omar Minaya and the Mets to perform and win it all.
In a negative way the Mets are the bigger news in NY right now. What Omar has done here in his tenure with the Mets is broaden the reconition of the franchise, negative or not. The Mets today are worth more money then ever before, you don't think Omar has a little to do with that? The Mets need to stay healthy, & as a fan of Los Mets, all I am looking for is a you gotta believe type of season.
LET'S GO METS!
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