This has me thinking of a time back in 1984 when I was a young Yankee fan, the Yankees had a good team, some real ballplayers like Dave Winfield, Ken Griffey, Willie Randolph, Rickey Henderson and of course the HITMAN Don Mattingly!
The offense was good but in those days the Yankees always lacked in the pitching department. All we had was an aging Ron Guidry and no one else...we had the lemons... guys like Andy Hawkins, the Shane Rawley's, Bob Tewksbury and the great Eddie Whitson.
Across town the Mets had what the Yankees didn't, they had plenty of pitching and a 19 year old wunderkind named Doc Gooden. Gooden was incredible, better than Matt Harvey or anyone I've seen. At 13 it was clear to me that the Mets were getting ready to take over the City and in those days they did.
With all the buzz the Mets were creating the Yankees felt like they needed to try and steal some of the shine away from the Mets, they wanted their version of Doc Gooden and I remember the hype. The Yankees had a phenom and just like Dwight Gooden he was only 19!
His name was Jose Rijo and he came up to pitch in 24 games that year but it was mostly in relief, he had only 5 starts, in total he pitched in 64 innings giving up 74 hits, he had 47K's and a 4.76 era, he was no Gooden. Eventually, as it was custom in those days, the Yankees ran out of patience and they traded Rijo away the very next year and that was the end of Rijo as a Yankee.
Now some 30 years later, the Mets have all this pitching and they are winning games again, they are on their way up and the Yankees are trying to hold on. Now here comes another Dominican like Jose Rijo in 1984, here comes Luis Severino.
A little over a month ago during the trading deadline, all the talk was that the Yankees need another arm, that they needed to strengthen their rotation, I wrote that if the Yankees were going to bolster their starting rotation they were going to do it by acquiring a Jeff Samardzija or a Mike Leake, that this is what they usually do around this time every year to strengthen their ball club but this never happened.
Instead Brian Cashman and the Yankees were being patience, they had Luis Severino down in the farm and they knew he was capable of quality starts. They stuck to their guns and they didn't trade him away for another old guy. Things are changing in Yankee land.
So far Luis Severino has more than held his own, at only 21 years old he can only get better., the numbers are solid, 95 plus on the radar on a regular basis, listed at 6 foot 195 but he seems larger, maybe it's mound presence. So far in 23 innings only 17 hits with 24K's and an ERA of 2.74. A small sample size pointing in the right direction.
Still you wonder if Luis Severino has that swing and miss stuff that can take him to the level of a Jacob deGrom or if Luis Severino is more like Zack Wheeler.
From what I've seen Luis Severino looks like a keeper, someone who the Yankees can move forward with and build. A future #1 like Jose Rijo who went on to be the ace of the Reds and a WS MVP.
When it comes to the NY Yankees and their legendary players, for the most part the Bronx Bombers have always been about the big bats, Ruth, Gerig, Dimaggio, Mantle and now Jeter, no team can match em, but when it comes to the pitching you have Whitey Ford and most recently there is Andy Pettite, but the NY Yankees never had a Franchise like Tom Seaver or a phenom like Doc Gooden, not even a Matt Harvey.
Luis Severino gives Yankee fans hope, there is something there, now lets see if he can live up to it.
14 comments:
This was why I was ok with the Yankees standing pat at the deadline, bringing up Severino was the deadline move. Been saying it for a while that this was the direction that the Yankees want to go in, bringing in the younger guys like Severino, Bird and eventually Judge, Sanchez, Refsnyder and Lindgren. The even nicer thing is that when these kids are really going to contribute in 2017 the Yankees are going to lose about 63 million in payroll and another 20 million the year after that when ARod's contract is up so they'll have PLENTY of cash to bring in the supporting cast to supplement these young players. This year has been a total surprise for me, I was willing to take a step back this year and next if it meant taking leaps forward over the next 5-10 years so I can't complain at all.
As for the glorious Mets and their Tom Seavers and Goodens and Harvey. Mets have 2 World Series and 2 pennants to show for it. Hell, Gooden won 2 rings with the Yankees. I don't know about you but I'll take the championships over having a franchise pitcher any day of the week.
It was a surprise to me when the Yanks did nothing, I would had bet the house that Refsnyder was being used as a chip and that a older establish ML pitcher was coming. So far you have 1 out of the batch that looks like a real player, hopefully for the Yanks they get another player or 2 coming up who really sticks, I'll see it when I believe it when the Yankees totally go this route giving the youngsters real time. Maybe by 2017 you will have 3 of these guys being big parts of the Yankees future, and like you said, the Yankees will be freeing off lots of money.
You know I'm not trying to compare the Mets to Yankees, cause you know Met fans know all about the 27 titles and all the legends I mentioned. But it is what it is, even through the Yankees have been around for like 100 years and the Mets half of that, the Yanks have never had a Tom Seaver or a Gooden or Matt Harvey. When you break it down everybody knows the Yankees have always been a franchise that has been about their superior hitters and the Mets have always been about their pitching.
Yo you saw heard about that fan who fell? I was watching the game scouting Severino who was great again, when all of a sudden the FOX announcer reacts to the guy falling, it was crazy, I heard the guy fell head 1st and that he was in his 60's, supposedly heckling AROD when he fell. Also this was the 3rd incident at Tuner Field. Some of these fans are crazy and go overboard, pond the intention, it's just a game.
I don't know why, like I've said they've been saying that for the last few years that this was the road they were going down. I have to disagree with you on one thing, you said only 1 seems like a real player. I think Bird will be a decent MLB player you have to remember that he's only 22 years old. Yup after next season Beltran, CC and Tex come off the books and the year after ARod so thats a good 80 mil right there.
It's not about the 27 titles, my argument is that you can have a great pitcher but you keep score by championships so the whole great pitcher thing doesn't really concern me.
I did hear about that guy, was watching the game when it happened. You talk about one of the dumbest possible ways to die that has to be it, guy wanted to yell at ARod and fell over the railing...like you said its only a game. I didn't know that its happened before at Turner. They're going to move into a new park in a couple of years they better make sure that the railings are higher.
Bird seems like a nice player but still way too early to know, it's like the Mets and Conforto, he looks good but you still don't know. The Yankees are on the right direction but it still has to work and for right now it's mostly talk. Not like the Mets who as far as pitchers goes, it's been stud after stud, with the Yankees you have Severino looking like the real deal so that's a start, now you see Bird, you saw some Refsnyder and others, Lindren, Sanchez and Judge we don't know. Of course if all 6 turn out to be studs it will be a wonderful world, but still you have to understand your odds and hope that 3 out of the 6 turn out to be good.
BRO you had me rolling, how can you say it's not about the 27 titles but that you keep score by Championship? You a funny guy. I fully understand that at the end of the day it all comes down to winners and losers, this was not meant to be a concern, I was just pointing out how a franchise like the Yankees and their history, with the Hall of Famers, and really never a Bob Gibson, Sandy Koufax, Roger Clemens, Pedro Martinez type, and that there is a reason why they are called the BX Bombers.
LOL Word! I didn't want to sound like an asshole but the old G was probably one, again the guy was 60 something and it looks like he was still acting a fool yelling at AROD, and what a way to go out probably had too many to drink, who knows? I heard he was Braves fan and a season ticket holder as well.
Yeah, its early but you have to start somewhere. The Mets have Harvey and DeGromm but the rest are question marks as well, I mean if we're going to use your argument. I'm going to be optimistic that a few of these guys in the Yankees system turn out to be decent players. Time will tell.
Ugh...what I meant was that you can't use the 27 titles because obviously the Yankees have been around for about 60 more years than the Mets. My argument is going back to 1969 the Mets have 2 World Series titles and 2 NL Pennants, the Yankees in that same time 7 World Series Titles and 4 AL Pennants so you're talking about franchise pitchers and whatnot and bringing up Seaver, Gooden and Harvey but to date not really a lot to show for it while you were saying that the Yankees haven't really produced a pitcher of that quality yet the Yankees have enjoyed unbelievably more success than the Mets in that time frame. So yeah they haven't produced a Koufax, Gibson, Pedro, Clemens but I'd say it's worked out quite well for them. I should have worded it better.
I'm looking forward to hearing NY sports talk tomorrow, last week it was all "The Mets are unstoppable" and the "Yankees can't score" It's funny how a weekend can change things, it's amusing how so many people act like baseball is a short season like football.
It's a start so you stay optimistic, I'm just always going to be a little leery about the NY Yankees when it comes to the farm, hopefully they will continue to build from within and stay away from the big contracts, than again these are the Yankees.
At the moment there is no comparing your Yanks to my Mets when it comes to the farm system, are you not yet still sold on Syndergaard? I understand that if you go by my argument you cant put Matz in the mix but I would not trade Matz for Severino, I know Matz has pitched in only 2 games compared to 6 by Severino but I can already tell that all Matz has to do is stay healthy. Obviously I like what I seen.
The Mets Seaver, Gooden, Harvey thing has nothing to do with wins and loses or titles, 27 to 2 there is no comparing, and from 1969 its the same thing, the Yankees have dominated. I just think this is more about 2 teams who build around where they play baseball games at, of course in you want to get more technical there is also the whole money differences to put into considerations, 1 franchise print money.
Always a blast listening to NYC sports radio and fans overreacting. Mets needed this win and the Yankees woke the bats up on Sunday. 5 more weeks.
Well, the last time the Yankees went this route things worked out pretty nicely. The other thing that you keep failing to recognize is that the business of baseball has changed. Gone are the days where the Yankees and Red Sox can just raid other teams for talent, there is so much more money in the game that teams can keep their players so this youth movement is also out of necessity. Yet another thing that you forget, after the ARod and CC contracts, I seriously doubt you'll see the Yankees go to one of those large, long term contracts and if you don't believe me please see Robinson Cano currently playing out the string in Seattle.
Nope, I'm using the Freddy Vargas method of judging so I'm not sold on Syndergaard and can't say anything about Matz since he's only pitched twice. So I'm going to take yet another page from the Freddy handbook, you know how you love to say things like "I'll believe it when I see it and These are the Yankees" Well, these are the Mets so yeah they have some nice young players but these are the Mets so they'll fuck it up one way or another.
1 franchise prints money? Are you serious? The Mets play in NEW YORK CITY, have a brand new stadium, their own network and yeah they play in NEW YORK CITY the largest market in the world. So please spare me the sisters of the poor routine.
So you seriously going to say that the Mets and Yankees play on equal grounds simply because they both play in the same NYC market? I guess your going to say the same about the Rangers and Islanders, or the Nets and Knicks. Lets be honest, the Yankees have always had lot more money to mess with than the Mets especially after the Madoff scheme, and especially after the late 90's when the Yankees took it to another level when they started the Yes Network. I mean when was the last time the Mets operated with a bigger payroll than the Yanks? I mean has it ever happened?
OK good point, going forward we'll go with my method, lets see how all my young Mets turn out and same goes for the young Yankees coming up soon. I guess we'll have to just give it some time before we can see the differences.
You seem to forget that the last time the Yankees went this route they were force too and that is why it all worked out so nicely. I may have not mentioned anything about how baseball has changed but don''t let that fool you, I can clearly see that those old ways of just raiding other teams talents are a thing of the past.
The Madoff thing hurt the Mets, although the owners won't publicly acknowledge it. If they're losing money then sell the team. You can't compare other sports because baseball has no salary cap. Plus the Knicks and Rangers are owned by one of the largest cable companies in the world who own their own network and building. The Mets cut in spending has only been the last 4 years, if you look at where they ranked payroll wise they averaged around 4th in the majors. So don't know where you get this loads of money from, I've said it before and I'll say it again at least the Yankees put their money where their mouth is. They're not afraid of spending and trying to upgrade.
Yes, let's wait and see what happens. You really need to give these things time. Just look at the Gregorious trade, back in April and May people were freaking out because he got off to a slow start and Shane Greene got off to a good start, now look at what has happened. Baseball season is a marathon.
Please tell me how exactly the Yankees were "forced" to go that route? I hope that you're not going to say Steinbrenner being banned because I don't know how that is forcing a team to adopt a philosophy.
My point is that teams like the Yanks, Knicks and Rangers do have an advantage on teams like the Mets, Nets and Islanders, when you are 2nd fiddle there is always a disadvantage. So teams like the Yanks, Rangers, and Knicks do operate with more money than the 2nd banana's.
I remember telling you how the Yanks had made a mistake by letting Shane Greene go, so I'm just like the rest.
Of course I'm talking about the Steinbrenner ban, if it weren't for that no way would the Yankees and Gene Michaels been able to do things differently, cause if George would not been banned it would had been buisness as usual. Are you really gonna say otherwise?
Ok, I think we've debated this enough. Saw this online today about ranking which teams have the easiest road to the playoffs:
1. New York Mets
Record: 72-58, lead NL East by 5½ games
Run differential: +53
Opponents' winning percentage: .439
Home/road: 15/17
Off-days: Sept. 3, 17, 28
Games vs. teams .500 or better: 9 of 32
Key series: vs. Nationals, Oct. 2-4
Overview: The second-biggest division lead in baseball. The best 1-2 punch this side of Clayton Kershaw and Zack Greinke. And now the easiest schedule? It’s almost like the baseball gods felt bad for the past decade or so and decided to look past what miserable owners the Wilpons have been and reward Mets fans for not giving up. Of their 32 games, 23 are against teams with winning percentages of .415 or worse. The best team they play is the Yankees. They’ve got nicely staggered off-days. Really, things could not be any better for the Mets … which is what makes it so scary. And it doesn’t help that the second-easiest schedule belongs to the …
In case you're wondering, the Nationals are #2
Man you gotta switch topics with this? I see you had nothing to come back at so I will let it slide bro...look no surprise that the Mets have a easy schedule, ok so the Mets have the 2nd biggest division lead, we don't have the best 1-2 in baseball but what we have is the best rotation in baseball.
Yea we have some miserable owners but we also have a great GM who made some great moves and now we in 1st place, this is just a good team with a bunch of guys that like each other and play as one. Look the Mets are where they are because they earned it so you just have to give credit for where they are right now, is it the Mets fault that the Nationals have not lived up to expectations? look they came into Citi field and we swept them good, on national TV, now teams don't want to play the Mets cause now they know. Still there is 6 more games with the Nats, plus the last 3 of the season, so just because the schedule looks in favor of the Mets don't mean I'm going to take shit lightly cause this is baseball.
You're a funny guy. Let it slide, I actually laughed out loud when I read that. No, I just saw that we're going in circles so had to switch things around.
Well, as an observer if I had to pick a team that was a lock to make the playoffs I would say its the Mets so if I were you I would take shit lightly and enjoy this month on the road to postseason ball in October.
In circles? that's what happens when I make some points that you cannot come back at LOL.
Do I think the Mets are a lock to make the playoffs? hell yea, I'm enjoying where the Mets are at for sure, the team is young and exciting and for the 1st time since 2006 they look like their going places, still...not until the Mets come into that series of the season vs the Nationals with a 4 games lead will I take it lightly.
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